Why you should take a risk every day with Julie Zhuo
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In this episode of Work Life, host Molly Graham interviews Julie Zhuo, former Facebook design and product leader and author of The Making of a Manager, about the transformative power of daily risk-taking. Zhuo shares her personal journey of overcoming self-perceived timidity by reframing risk not as dramatic life changes, but as small, consistent acts of courage—like speaking up in meetings, setting boundaries, or admitting vulnerability. She emphasizes that confidence isn't a prerequisite for risk; rather, it's built through repeated exposure to discomfort. Drawing from her own experiences—transitioning from engineering to design, stepping into management, and launching a writing practice—Zhuo illustrates how a deliberate 'practice' of everyday risk can build resilience and growth over time. She distinguishes between fearlessness and courage, arguing that true courage lies in acting despite fear, driven by a shared purpose. The conversation also explores how managers can foster psychological safety by trusting their teams, embracing failure as learning, and aligning around shared values. Ultimately, Zhuo advocates for a mindset shift: risk isn't something you're either good or bad at—it's a muscle you can strengthen through daily intentionality.
Confidence is built through risk, not the other way around—take small, uncomfortable actions regularly to grow your courage.
Distinguish between fearlessness (acting without fear) and courage (acting despite fear for a shared purpose).
Psychological safety in teams comes from leaders who trust their teams, own outcomes, and encourage learning from failure.
Use self-reflection to ground decisions in long-term values, not short-term reactions or fear.
Risk doesn’t have to be big—small acts like saying 'I’m not okay' or taking a break can be powerful daily practices.
…and 3 more takeaways available in PodZeus
Sponsor: Wise – Smart Global Money
Sponsorship for Wise, the international money app, highlighting its ability to send, spend, and receive in over 40 currencies with no hidden fees and mid-market exchange rates.
Redefining Risk: It’s Not All or Nothing
“The people who are actually good at taking risks didn't get there by making one giant leap or even by taking big risks over and over again. They built a practice.”
Julie Zhuo’s Personal Journey with Fear and Courage
“I realized that when I look back, the things that made me proudest were when I did something that I didn't think I was going to do. That was scary for me.”
Turning Risk into a Daily Practice
“It's not always about speaking up more. Sometimes it's about learning to not say something, even though you really want to.”
Courage vs. Fearlessness: A Defining Distinction
“Courage is like you are aware of what all the consequences and ramifications might be. And it is scary and there's no guarantee that they won't happen, but you believe this is important because you're doing it towards some greater end.”
“Courage is like you are aware of what all the consequences and ramifications might be. And it is scary and there's no guarantee that they won't happen, but you believe this is important because you're doing it towards some greater end.”
“I realized that when I look back, the things that made me proudest were when I did something that I didn't think I was going to do. That was scary for me.”
“The most important thing is to ask ourselves what really matters. What would I consider if I look back 20 years from now, 50 years from now that I would have been proud to do?”
Host
Guest
Julie Zhuo
person
Molly Graham
person
organization
The Making of a Manager
book
Wise
organization
Sundial
organization
Dante's Inferno
other
TED
organization
Pushkin Industries
organization
Exact
organization
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