456. High Conflict with Amanda Ripley

In this powerful episode of Psychologists Off the Clock, host Dr. Yael Schoenbrunn interviews Amanda Ripley, bestselling author of High Conflict, about the destructive dynamics of high conflict and how it consumes relationships, communities, and even our own sense of self. Ripley explains that while good conflict is essential for growth and progress—like exercise for the mind—high conflict is a self-sustaining, destructive force fueled by contempt, disgust, and the false narrative of good versus evil. She illustrates this with compelling stories, including that of Mark Linus, an environmental activist who became so entrenched in high conflict that he misrepresented scientific evidence, only to later publicly apologize after realizing his own blindness. Ripley emphasizes that high conflict narrows our vision, causes us to mimic our enemies, and ultimately harms the very values we claim to protect. Despite its emotional appeal and sense of righteousness, high conflict is costly to our mental health, relationships, and society. The episode also explores how media and journalism often perpetuate high conflict through clickbait and outrage-driven content, and offers practical tools—like asking before speaking: 'Does it need to be said? By me? Right now?'—to interrupt the cycle. The co-host discussion reinforces the idea that staying in good conflict requires intentional effort, curiosity, and a willingness to see nuance, even in those we deeply disagree with.